Brand New Doll From Matt McMullen

[Britti_Lover]

Although this is a well refined skeleton there are still issues that Abyss is continuing to address, and Phoenix is running with the most current design which is used in the manufacture of RealDolls. Time will tell how this doll holds up but to guarantee anything of this sort is irresponsible and absolutely not accurate.

What I said was "Boy Toys" should not need the kind of Joint Repairs we have seen rampantly on Realdolls. I've known people to buy THREE Realdolls and have the Joints Break ON ALL THREE within weeks of purchasing the dolls.

How do you stop these rampant Joint Failures we have seen on Realdolls?

One - lighten the dolls - this puts less stress put on the frame's joints and will ensure greater durability.

I honestly believe that "Boy Toys" will not suffer the kind of rampant joint failures we have seen on Realdolls. And for many, this reason alone is enough to justify a Boy Toy purchase.

[Nonfactor]

One cannot say that any brand will never have a doll that requires repairs.

Of course but one can say the opposite: That a certain brand is much more likely to fail than another. No finger wires, for example, won't mean the fingers are indestructible but the presence of finger wires greatly increases the chance of finger damage. Joint failure can happen on all skeletons (except for Wolverine's) but some brands develop severe joint failures within a year while others usually last 5 or more years before any major failures happen.

[Abyss]

What I said was "Boy Toys" should not need the kind of Joint Repairs we have seen rampantly on Realdolls. I've known people to buy THREE Realdolls and have the Joints Break ON ALL THREE within weeks of purchasing the dolls.

How do you stop these rampant Joint Failures we have seen on Realdolls?

One - lighten the dolls - this puts less stress put on the frame's joints and will ensure greater durability.

I honestly believe that "Boy Toys" will not suffer the kind of rampant joint failures we have seen on Realdolls. And for many, this reason alone is enough to justify a Boy Toy purchase.

Britti, you can believe what you like but please don’t post it as gospel truth. No one owns a Boy Toy yet so you have no idea how it will hold up. Some dolls break in the first week because of misuse (there are a few on this forum). Some dolls break because of mechanical failure although this is rare and others break because they are dropped. There is NO empirical evidence that heavier dolls break more frequently because of strain on the skeleton.

Matt K, in fact, was working with a body 8 last week which he dropped repeatedly while trying to photograph it (they don’t like to sit on bar stools unsupported but Matt prefers to use no stands when possible in photographing the dolls). The doll he dropped has NO damage to it despite being dropped 3 feet multiple times at multiple angles. It didn’t even get a finger wire poking through. While Stacy was in California doing photography with us, we vigorously and aggressively posed almost all of our body types including dropping a few and none experienced any damage. But we have people who've had issues with bodies 4 and 2, RealDoll's smallest bodies, for whatever reason with the same level of frequency as breakages on larger bodies. It should be noted that of the 400 dolls we sell in a year, we typically hear of less than 10 joint failures annually (in new and old dolls, not just the ones made that year). It should also be noted that these breakages are rarely joint failures because of quality control but rather from long-term use or in some cases misuse. Since the Boy Toy skeletons are the same as RealDoll skeletons and some of the prototypes were made with old RD parts, you can anticipate similar successes and failures which are completely unrelated to weight.

Britti, you are a respected long-time doll owner and you often have excellent information but please try to avoid getting wrapped up in the excitement of a new doll and expounding on its benefits without actual information. Oh, and not all platinum silicone is medical grade or superior. If you want more information on silicones, we have never made what we use a secret. Feel free to email me at Bronwen@realdoll.com for more information.

[Britti_Lover]

And YOU Bronwen are a stunningly beautiful and a VERY intelligent woman. I'm so glad that I had the honar to meet you. Abyss is VERY lucky to have you.



However, I've had LOTS of friends with Bodies 8, 9 and 10 who have had serious and major joint failures. One even said he was so fed up with fixing joint repairs on his body 8 that he'd never buy another Realdoll!

Now, I've also got lots of friends with bodies 2's and they are not complaining about their dolls at all! Nothing!

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm I see a trend here!


Anyway, I'm gunna stop making any additional comments on Realdolls and Boy Toys, the emtions are running quite high here.

I'll just stick with Kinsi for now. She is really heavy - BUT with VERY gentle treatment she is indeed surviving - and I really enjoy playing with her:

[technoguy]

I understand that Abyss gives a 30 warranty on "workmanship" for its RD's. I think a lot of potential BoyToy customers are wondering if Phoenix Situdios will also give the same warranty on this new doll?

And IF a BoyToy fails IN NORMAL USE within 30 days of the customer receiving it, exactly what action will Phoenix Studios take to remedy the situation. I would certain have to consider this due to a "defect" in workmanship.

If the customer decides that he does NOT want to get involved in a complicated repair job, will he be able to get a refund of his $7500 USD upon return of the doll?


technoguy

[flavortang]

Yeah, it's kind of difficult to say "This doll is going to be invincible!" when no one actually owns a BoyToy yet. I think it is a mass hysteria, almost, that people WANT to believe that a new doll will be worlds greater than the current generation dolls. Unless some bizarre alloy is found on the planet that is indestructible, light AND cheap to mass produce, there won't be doll skeletons out there that are 100% unbreakable and resistant to damage.

I think it's also sort of insulting to the intelligence of doll makers when people just sling out suggestions on how to improve the dolls, as if the makers themselves never pondered the suggestions themselves during the countless hours of R&D before a doll is first created. It's easy to make suggestions, but hard to do when you have to put idea to paper and paper to substance.

I just hope that when I get my RD, its skeleton won't suffer damage until it's had several years behind it.

[raysmod]

the emtions are running quite high here.

Britti Lover you got it right there mate. In fact over the last day or two, friends are even having words with each other, let alone antagonists. Xmas does tend to fray the nerves.

[Nonfactor]

Flavor, it's mostly hope. Of course noone expects 100% reliability but we don't see owners of 4woods or Orient dolls complain much about joint failures.

[Abyss]

And YOU Bronwen are a stunningly beautiful and a VERY intelligent woman. I'm so glad that I had the honar to meet you. Abyss is VERY lucky to have you.



However, I've had LOTS of friends with Bodies 8, 9 and 10 who have had serious and major joint failures. One even said he was so fed up with fixing joint repairs on his body 8 that he'd never buy another Realdoll!

Now, I've also got lots of friends with bodies 2's and they are not complaining about their dolls at all! Nothing!

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm I see a trend here!


Anyway, I'm gunna stop making any additional comments on Realdolls and Boy Toys, the emtions are running quite high here.

I'll just stick with Kinsi for now. She is really heavy - BUT with VERY gentle treatment she is indeed surviving - and I really enjoy playing with her

Britti, thank you for the compliment but it isn’t necessary to blow smoke up my skirt. I am just doing my job, and that is primarily to make sure that accurate information is out there. I spend a great deal of time responding to misconceptions that make my job much more difficult. This has nothing to do with emotion, it's all about how much misinformation I have to repair. And with regards to this new company, that has made my job even more difficult because people don’t understand that Phoenix Studios & Abyss Creations are different companies. I am inundated with literally hundreds of emails I have to wade through daily which is why you see me working on weekends and over the holidays.

As for your friends' experiences that still doesn’t compare to what we hear about - as I said, there is no empirical evidence that one body type is more prone to breakage than another. Body 9s are the same as bodies 6 and 7 aside from breast size which has no bearing on joint breakage between body types. It is much more likely that the heavier dolls are dropped or mishandled more because of weight which can result in breaks more than the "stress" of the silicone on the skeletons.

We have publicly acknowledged bad years as they have occurred too. It's known that 2005 was a bad year for RealDoll skeletons and the breaks occurred in all body types regardless of weight. I would really appreciate it if people would stick to actual fact when talking on the forum rather than spreading rumors and misinformation that people like me have to take time to repair. I've made myself very available to forum members so that questions can be completely and accurately answered rather than leaving it to other members to guess, surmise and armchair-engineer. Hopefully Joe will also be equipped to do the same for Boy Toy dolls because I am sure they will be dealing with just as many misconceptions and skewed facts in the future.

** Edited to remove Kinsi photo to save space.

[glyph127]

the emtions are running quite high here.

. I've made myself very available to forum members so that questions can be completely and accurately answered rather than leaving it to other members to guess, surmise and armchair-engineer. Hopefully Joe will also be equipped to do the same for Boy Toy dolls because I am sure they will be dealing with just as many misconceptions and skewed facts in the future.

Please lets be thankful that Abyss is making themselves available here to provide info we might otherwise have difficulty getting. Those who have been forum members for a while can recall when Matt McMullin made himself available on the forum which he does not appear to do any longer. Maybe part of it has to do with his busy schedule, but the fact that he probably got fed up with the criticism he dealt with here did not help either. I personally dont make comments here often for this very reason.
My body 10 had a knee screw that sheared off within a week after I received her. Though I mentioned it here, I did not make a lot of negative comments about it to discredit Abyss-they repaired it without a problem, learned from their mistake and besides a few minor repairs here and there she has been fine.
My point is, while this is an open forum for discussion we should try to make respectful comments without insulting (or scaring away) anyone and give Abyss and Phoenixstudios tactful advice and feedback so that they can better learn how to improve the quality and price of their products . Like any other company they are not perfect and are working on getting better. Are the prices too high? Maybe, but I dont believe that dolls of this quality (like expensive cars) are meant to be afforded by everyone. And as newer improvements are developed prices could increase-especially with Abyss if the BoyToy improvements are implemented into the Realdoll. But I sure would prefer that these two companies exist with their high quality dolls and prices than not.

[raysmod]

glyph127.

You make very good points.

Though. there is stuff going on now between Bronwen and Briittilover in their exchange of views, better not to be aired in a public forum. They should be sorting these differences out through PM's. Not pleasant seeing "comrades" fall out like this, unless you have a voyeuristic inclination. And hopefully they will patch things up, soon.

Maybe I'm totally off the mark and letting it all hang out is the honest way to go. What do others on the Doll Forum think?

[Crazyhorse]

glyph127.

Not pleasant seeing "comrades" fall out like this, unless you have a voyeuristic inclination. And hopefully they will patch things up, soon.

Maybe I'm totally off the mark and letting it all hang out is the honest way to go. What do others on the Doll Forum think?

I don't see any hostility that would indicate a "falling out", just a manufacturer trying to correct some misleading statements (which of course needs to be done publicly or it does no good to the public.) I know BL means well but sometimes his statements about RD (and others) seem to mostly be wishful thinking, stated as fact. A few "in my opinion"s or "seems to me"s wouldn't hurt.

[midiman]

Like any other company they are not perfect and are working on getting better. Are the prices high? Maybe, but I dont believe that dolls of this quality (like expensive cars) are meant to be afforded by everyone.

Frankly, I think based on cost of material and labor, and the fact that they are manufacturer direct they are way overpriced. (based on information I've collected over the last year. When you think of what $7500 can buy it does seem a bit excessive. Two BT's coul dbuy you a new car...think about it.

I'd like to see products like this hitting a broader market in the affordibility area...not just Ferrari owners. Prices should be coming down on this type of product with the increased demand.

As to beating on a manufacturer...regardless of what price a product is sold for, if they back up their product they way they did yours, then there should be no complaints. Anybody can have problems, it's how they address those problems that sets the good from the bad. The RD customer satisfaction poll I set up, shows one of the highest customer satisfaction ratings on this forum.

The BT's are cute. Would have liked to have one for the documentary, but alas, I budget can only handle so much, and Bianca (from Lars and the Realgirl) seemed the right choice at the time...she's already a star

Viva la Realdoll!

[raysmod]

Crazyhorse,

"Blowing smoke up my skirt" is not a flattering reference, nor common in NZ here, and the internet definition confirms this.

As with all email, you have to somewhat second guess whether the sender was fuming or casually mentioning something in passing. And the tone of each of the emails is not friendly rapport, no matter how polite you slant your interpretation to be. All a storm in a tea cup and business is back on track.

[Abyss]

Crazyhorse,

"Blowing smoke up my skirt" is not a flattering reference, nor common in NZ here, and the internet definition confirms this.

As with all email, you have to somewhat second guess whether the sender was fuming or casually mentioning something in passing. And the tone of each of the emails is not friendly rapport, no matter how polite you slant your interpretation to be. All a storm in a tea cup and business is back on track.

You're misreading this dialog, Raysmod. Crazyhorse was correct in how he interpreted it. Blowing smoke means there is no need to give me idle compliments. How I look is completely irrelevant to my position. The comment was meant to state that I dont expect or want pretty compliments, I want to give accurate information which is the entire purpose of my discussions and availability on the forum. This stuff isnt personal for me; it's a job that I take very seriously. When comments are out on the forum that are misleading or innaccurate, part of my job description requires me to come on here and put things in perspective.

I have met Britti_lover and I know he means well but he brought up points publicly that needed to be addressed publicly in order for other members to get the benefit of accurate and complete information. My desire to have all information accurate and complete is the reason you all have a direct email available to you where you can ask Abyss/me questions. I'm the only one who will be available through the entire holiday break to answer questions: Abyss is closed from December 22 - January 2 but I will be working. I imagine Phoenix is probably closed for the holidays too.