EVO Skeleton - Is my doll's hand broken?

Wheezer · Post by **Wheezer** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 6:02 am

Thanks Seagull ...

Looking over the comments/problems by the OP and Shiranui Gen-An they may be in a decent repair position, since both dolls are new.

In many cases by the time there are finger issues the TPE in that area has seen a bit of life and you need to be concerned with TPE degradation along with repair sealing.
Chemical sealing of finger repair has been done successfully by Arthur1960 using genuine 3M 94 primer. He gets small bottles of it in the UK from Amazon, so you might want to source it there.
Just make sure you get LEGITIMATE 3M 94, there are some shady fakes out there.

Not to cast any bad light on WM or any manufacturer, but they are in the business of making dolls, not after sales repair of them. From what I have seen any pre-mold repairs they need to do on a doll is done with HEAT, not chemicals. So while they may sell a liquid and call it "TPE glue", it is NOT something they regularly use on the dolls they fix in the factory and sell to consumers. Just something to consider.
However if you can get something from them and it appears to work OK, then great. Just test it first.

As for heat repair, you will really need a small temperature controlled iron with the correct tip to do a decent job and not cause MORE damage during the fix. I have found that there are just a few specific and inexpensive units that have the temperature range, control and tip options that work well. While there are many expensive (and inexpensive) soldering stations and units out there, most do not make it easy to do fine work with TPE. Either the temperatures start too high, tips are too big or tip options are not great. Melting and moving TPE is not the same as melting metal.

Hope it helps.
Cheers!
... W ...

Synthian · Post by **Synthian** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 8:39 am

Wheezer wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 6:02 am
As for heat repair, you will really need a small temperature controlled iron with the correct tip to do a decent job and not cause MORE damage during the fix. I have found that there are just a few specific and inexpensive units that have the temperature range, control and tip options that work well. While there are many expensive (and inexpensive) soldering stations and units out there, most do not make it easy to do fine work with TPE. Either the temperatures start too high, tips are too big or tip options are not great. Melting and moving TPE is not the same as melting metal.

Hope it helps.
Cheers!
... W ...

Hi Wheezer, do you mind sharing what soldering station you use? I got this temperature controlled soldering iron and it just melted my test piece, did not join the cut I made at all. I also got this IR temperature gun to monitor 125c melting point and 145c maximum and it seems to work on the TPE but not the soldering tip itself.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RY ... UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JC ... =UTF8&th=1

Wheezer, thanks for sharing your experience to help our girls.

Synthian · Post by **Synthian** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 8:47 am

Shiranui Gen-An wrote: ↑Sun Jul 23, 2023 8:09 am so I cleaned the cut with oil and glued it, and that's about it!

Unfortunately, it had become loose again, so I had to cut it open again and tighten it a 2nd time, thus recognizing that the thread was damaged. Maybe I screwed it too tight the first time. It's holding now, but the wound has become pretty ugly, and I will need help to get this fixed next, but that's off topic here.

Hope someone can use this.

Welcome to the forum, Shiranui Gen-An !

You are very skilled and courageous to perform such complicated surgery on your new girl ! I can sure use your post as I am waiting on an Irontech EVO, thank you for your detailed skeleton pictures and solution.

I have also sealed an incision too soon and had to reopen it later. Now, I do not seal until months have passed and I am sure the surgery is a success. When I do seal, I use TPE paste which is easy to apply with a wide Yasso popsicle stick and no heat is required, except if you want to finish the exterior excess with a heat gun. I find TPE glue melts the TPE and if I am unsuccessful closing the wound, the incision has changed shape and would need TPE paste to fill it out anyway. Others are more skilled at TPE glue and soldering than I.
https://www.coeros.com/product/tpe-sex-doll-paste/

I have also used Silbond FDA grade on TPE and it works very well, but, while flexible, is stiffer than TPE and I only use it in places that aren't very visible like closing insert holes. Or on incisions that may need reopening because this sealant can be removed with Acetone and gentle tugging. The bad thing is I can not make a finished surface.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NU ... UTF8&psc=1

Your photos and videos have helped Evie and I, many thanks. You are very brave and talented to have performed surgery your new girl, if I can be of assistance to you and your girl's success, feel free to DM me, good luck, brother

: Evie smile2.gif (4.59 MiB) Viewed 814 times

Wheezer · Post by **Wheezer** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 2:32 pm

Synthian wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 8:39 am Hi Wheezer, do you mind sharing what soldering station you use? I got this temperature controlled soldering iron and it just melted my test piece, did not join the cut I made at all. I also got this IR temperature gun to monitor 125c melting point and 145c maximum and it seems to work on the TPE but not the soldering tip itself.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RY ... UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JC ... =UTF8&th=1

Wheezer, thanks for sharing your experience to help our girls.

From what I have seen an iron that is too hot will appear to melt the TPE, but is doing so at such a high temperature that the TPE is damaged and will not bond back. You need an iron with a lower minimum temperature and good temperature control. Plus the goal of "sneaking up" on the melt point of your specific TPE blend. Thus you need an iron whose minimum temperature is BELOW the TPE melt point.

After going through MANY soldering irons types for TPE repair, the standard one I use now is a "QUECOO T12-959 Soldering Iron Station".
Like the one on AMAZON (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09TVMFB9D) or ALIEXPRESS (https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803527117780.html).

Below are the unit specs.

: (1)Temp_Range.jpg (69.9 KiB) Viewed 796 times

To me for TPE work I consider the minimum temperature a deal breaker. A unit with a low range of 100c or lower is needed for TPE work, very few meet this specification. Most soldering stations have a lowest approximate temp of 150c to 200c. You need that for solder melting to get a good flow and get over the metal sinking the heat from the joint. Doing TPE work is the complete opposite of that.

A unit like this uses a T-12 cartridge soldering tip. These are great for TPE since the cart has a temperature sensor inside it and you get better low end control. Most units ship with a general purpose "K" (Knife) tip, but many others are available.
The C1 and JL02 are great for fine repairs.

You can get a decent set on AMAZON HERE (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07FYY64MX)

: (2)T12-Tips.jpg (64.74 KiB) Viewed 796 times

A handle like the M8 also helps a lot in repairs. It is light, easy to maneuver and allows you to swap tips if needed. Just pull out the cartrige/tip and install a new one. No handle part unscrewing required.

: (3)M8-Handle(sm).jpg (31.83 KiB) Viewed 796 times

Granted that this is not the cheapest soldering iron out there, but it does work quite well for TPE heat repair AND general and detail soldering. However you just need ONE thing, the iron itself. Most common irons seem to start at too high a temperature and don't have decent temperature control. Using the wrong tool can not only lead to poor results, but a lot of aggravation when things just don't seem to work right. Plus compared to what your doll itself and all the other related items cost, it is not really that much.

Hope it helps.
Cheers!
... W ...

Shiranui Gen-An · Post by **Shiranui Gen-An** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 3:12 pm

Thank you guys, that's really a whole bunch of useful hints you dropped here! I can't wait for my next salary to arrive, and then I will look into the heat repair options. These informations are very helpful!

Post by **Birdie Flyhigh** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 3:56 pm

Its all about mindset. Sit back and enjoy the other 90% of her.
It's abit like when you get a scratch on a new car or bike. It looks like the biggest damage in the world. The more you look a it the worse it seems. You go blind to the rest of your investment. This is where you might do something rash and regret it. So don't!
Then after a few days you'll hardly notice it. Realising how small the damage is. Time to admire the rest of her.
You know you can get it sorted. You're in no rush. You've got time to look into all the ways to fix it, viewable on this forum in the repair/maintenance section.
Take a step back.

Synthian · Post by **Synthian** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 7:14 pm

Wheezer wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 2:32 pm
From what I have seen an iron that is too hot will appear to melt the TPE, but is doing so at such a high temperature that the TPE is damaged and will not bond back.

Hope it helps.
Cheers!
... W ...

Thanks that is exactly what happened to me on the test piece. It did not bond back.

Evie needs some precise hand surgery and I have saved your Amazon recommends for that day.

I'm thinking of getting a heat gun station so I can get more precise finish work (mine is the size of a blow dryer with only 2 settings), they all seem to go down to 100C any thoughts on those?

Sharing your experience has helped us a lot ! Evie and I appreciate you

seagull · Post by **seagull** » Wed Jul 26, 2023 8:09 am

Arthur1960 put up a post for reattaching a nipple, very delicate n not suitable for a heat solution, serves as a bit of a guide on what can be fixed with heat and what is better treated with a good adhesive solution

viewtopic.php?p=2391192#p2391192

Wheezer · Post by **Wheezer** » Thu Jul 27, 2023 6:43 pm

Synthian wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 7:14 pm I'm thinking of getting a heat gun station so I can get more precise finish work (mine is the size of a blow dryer with only 2 settings), they all seem to go down to 100C any thoughts on those?

A temperature controlled air gun selection is not as critical as the soldering iron. With the air gun you can alter the heat to the TPE by adjusting the air temperature, air flow and distance to the doll. Something you can not do with the soldering iron. As long as you get a "rework gun" type you should be fine.
Below is an example of one of mine.

: 24.jpg (370.48 KiB) Viewed 684 times

Just make sure it is has an adjustable temperature range. Avoid hair dryers, paint stripper guns and other ones that are high heat but not fully adjustable. Although you could use them, they have a fine line between repair and destroy .... something that you really want to avoid if you can.

Many folks use an IR temperature gun to monitor the TPE as they use the air. I have one but generally do not use it.
I just start low, work my way up and watch as the TPE starts to react under heat. I went over the way I do it HERE (viewtopic.php?p=2328282#p2328282)

Using hot air for repairs is not hard ... IF you go slow and practice a bit first. Make sure the TPE is supple and oiled, take your time and STOP if you see things going in the wrong direction.
An example of NOT doing those things is HERE (viewtopic.php?p=2318969#p2318969).
A good example of repair using hot soldering irons and other hot devices is HERE (viewtopic.php?t=161581)

I only included the bad repair link since most fix and repair folks (myself included) want to make it seem easy so we can encourage folks to repair their own dolls.
All of us have had muck ups and not great results, but those never get posted, only the near perfect results after much effort.
Eventually after a while we can get to near first pass perfect, but it takes a while.

So just get the right gear, take your time, practice a bit on a non-visible area and you should be able to get a repair that works for you.

Cheers!
... W ...

Synthian · Post by **Synthian** » Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:47 am

Thank you for sharing that !

Shiranui Gen-An · Post by **Shiranui Gen-An** » Thu Aug 03, 2023 5:13 pm

Thank you very much again, all of you! Your recommendations helped me make a decision about what to buy, and today, I received my first tool, a brand new rework station. Here it is:

: Rework station; P8032246.jpg (959.56 KiB) Viewed 570 times

It was a bit pricey, the market here is different from the US or UK market, you don't get all the same products here. This is the reason why I can't find this 3M Primer, there's no chance to find the right item when I search for that term in Germany. But that's a different story. I also ordered a soldering iron with adjustable temperature, but it takes 2-3 weeks to deliver, so I gave it a try and followed your hints (take it slowly, start with low temperature and air, use oil etc.), and after some adjustments, it started to happen... the TPE started to become moldable, and with the help of a spoon I could manage to close the wound rather decently, considering the way it looked before. Too bad I didn't make a before shot of it, so when you look at it, you might still say it's pretty obvious, but it's really much better than before. I found a picture where you can see the side of the wound before it, it's quite the crater...

: before; P7232184.jpg (153.09 KiB) Viewed 570 times

Well, now it looks like this:

: after; P8032241.jpg (691.27 KiB) Viewed 570 times

: P8032243.jpg (686.32 KiB) Viewed 570 times

Considering that this is my very first try, I'm quite satisfied with this first result. I'm sure it could be done better, but right now I'm very happy that my babe is back to health. A little makeup should make it nearly invisible now. =)

Wheezer · Post by **Wheezer** » Thu Aug 03, 2023 5:23 pm

Nice rework gun, that should be a handy TPE tool.

Also excellent job on the solder repair. Once you get the right gear and start low and slow you should be able to continue going great repairs.
The arm looks nice as it is, just a little beauty mark remain, as on a real human.

You COULD try to flatten it out more, but might make it worse.

One option is to oil the area, set your solder iron near the melt point and try to "skim" the protruding bump with the edge of the soldering iron tip tube.
The edge of the hot tube, not the tip. The only challenge is that when you flatten the TPE bump you displace the material and then you have a bit bigger area to smooth.

An alternative it to use a hot spoon. That is oil the area, heat the inner side of a spoon with the hot air gun, then use the other side to gently press and flow down the TPE.
It takes a bit of practice, but many folks here really like the hot spoon approach.

However right now the repair looks good as it is and you should be proud of the results.

Cheers!
... W ...

seagull · Post by **seagull** » Thu Aug 03, 2023 6:30 pm

Shiranui Gen-An
https://zalepi.eu/shop/tools-and-access ... -94-237ml/

Shiranui Gen-An · Post by **Shiranui Gen-An** » Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:45 pm

Thank you very much for the link, seagull!

Also thanks to Wheezer for the nice words and the advice on how to make it better. The soldering pen is still to come, but I received a set of different soldering tips today which might come in handy. Just like the ones shown some posts earlier.

Shiranui Gen-An · Post by **Shiranui Gen-An** » Tue Aug 15, 2023 5:50 pm

Dollpark made a video now about this issue. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to link it here, but you can find it at dollpark.com/mediathek, it's called "Reparatur eines losen Handgelenks" and it's in German, but if you don't understand that guy, you can still see what he's doing.