Hi! Working on a concept, looking for ideas

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:01 pm

I do not know how far I can get into the skull. For my first go round I need it to dramaticly improve what is at the price point, then expand! But all these ideas are great and zactly what I am looking for!

RobXYZ · Post by **RobXYZ** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:08 pm

maddmatter70 wrote: I agree 100% i think a heal.arch, and ball are actually what lit me up to this idea. I think I can design a skeleton that takes 90% of the stress off the "flesh" and can be tossed around and still land on its feet, so to speak.....

Do you think it would be possible also to design more realistic (and less"wobbly") toes? Or it's something very hard to do considering the small size of the toes?

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 6:35 pm

Do you think it would be possible also to design more realistic (and less"wobbly") toes? Or it's something very hard to do considering the small size of the toes?

Yes this is within my scope. Fingers, toes, free standing, "springy", posablity and love making are my first targets with my skeletal frame. Will be working closely with several other engineers and industry experts to bring these items to fruition. And anything else I can get in the scope of the skeletal frame. I want very much to deliver a frame that satisfies everything, but one bite at a time is the way to eat a large meal!!

briwri01 · Post by **briwri01** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:44 pm

I'm seeing some wonderful ideas surface here, and I guess it all boils down to engineering and manufacturing. I like the idea of a hidden switch of sorts to control stiffness of the joints. I'll give an example...
I'm an old dude, can't move well and have trouble lifting. My first doll - Shelby - was ordered with tight joints for standing and holding position. She's (relatively) small and light - a WM 158A - but her knees and hips are so stiff that it's tough to position her or make corrections once she is standing for photos. Latest doll was a SM 163A - much heavier but much more realistic proportions and limbs, and easier to pose because even though Jeff and I requested tight joints she is very easy to move around... and I was also surprised by how mobile the SM skeleton is, but sometimes she almost falls over as I am moving her because of that. The point being that if you can control the stiffness based on the current need, it would be wonderful.
Second point is the feet. Sure it would be nice to have realistic feet, arches, etc, etc, but honestly? I would settle for realistic SIZE feet! What woman 5'4" and having a nice figure wears a size 13 CHILD's Shoe! We think nothing of adding 10 or 15 pounds to our dolls to have the hugest tits humanly possible... let's add a pound or two for realistically sized feet! Let's get some real size feet so we can buy real shoes, heels and boots for our girls without having to take the risk of ordering from a Chinese site that never ships the item (been there, done that!) Anything less than size 3 is simply impossible to find easily in the U.S. I've seen some great photos of girls in killer heels and boots here, and would love to know how the hell you do it! Even buying the smallest shoes I can find my doll's feet roll and twist since they are far too small for the footwear.
I love the idea of motors/actuators for positioning. With technology evolving the way it is, I can't imagine it will be too long before we can pick up a remote, stand up our dolls, pose them and move them. I just watched Cherry 2000 again the other night... we're honestly not very far away from that!

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:53 pm

briwri01 wrote:I'm seeing some wonderful ideas surface here, and I guess it all boils down to engineering and manufacturing. I like the idea of a hidden switch of sorts to control stiffness of the joints. I'll give an example...
I'm an old dude, can't move well and have trouble lifting. My first doll - Shelby - was ordered with tight joints for standing and holding position. She's (relatively) small and light - a WM 158A - but her knees and hips are so stiff that it's tough to position her or make corrections once she is standing for photos. Latest doll was a SM 163A - much heavier but much more realistic proportions and limbs, and easier to pose because even though Jeff and I requested tight joints she is very easy to move around... and I was also surprised by how mobile the SM skeleton is, but sometimes she almost falls over as I am moving her because of that. The point being that if you can control the stiffness based on the current need, it would be wonderful.
Second point is the feet. Sure it would be nice to have realistic feet, arches, etc, etc, but honestly? I would settle for realistic SIZE feet! What woman 5'4" and having a nice figure wears a size 13 CHILD's Shoe! We think nothing of adding 10 or 15 pounds to our dolls to have the hugest tits humanly possible... let's add a pound or two for realistically sized feet! Let's get some real size feet so we can buy real shoes, heels and boots for our girls without having to take the risk of ordering from a Chinese site that never ships the item (been there, done that!) Anything less than size 3 is simply impossible to find easily in the U.S. I've seen some great photos of girls in killer heels and boots here, and would love to know how the hell you do it! Even buying the smallest shoes I can find my doll's feet roll and twist since they are far too small for the footwear.
I love the idea of motors/actuators for positioning. With technology evolving the way it is, I can't imagine it will be too long before we can pick up a remote, stand up our dolls, pose them and move them. I just watched Cherry 2000 again the other night... we're honestly not very far away from that!

Thank you! This type of feedback is exactly what a guy like me (crazy engineer/mad scientist) needs to make this happen! One thing you said here "Sure it would be nice to have realistic feet, arches, etc, etc, but honestly? I would settle for realistic SIZE feet!" is something I think current doll engineering is missing. The human form is perfect for what it does, if a doll is designed to emulate the characteristics rather than put on a "facade" so to speak, you will have a better result. I think they have over looked many material choice and manufacturability for cheapness. No fault of their own, had to get started somehow, now a mind like my own can improve it.

briwri01 · Post by **briwri01** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 12:31 am

I really believe one of the simplest, cheapest, most effective mods that can be made is to simply give the dolls bigger feet so they can wear real, available footwear!!

The Doll Laboratory · Post by **The Doll Laboratory** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:32 am

Hello,

briwri01 wrote:1. Face that can be posed, even if only to a small degree. That would make photos in different situations so much more realistic, rather than having the same smile or pout all the time no matter what the situation.

Something like this already exists. I make a Teeth&Tongue set which allows some facial expressions. I use the T&T sets for my comic. See the links in my signature.

The Doll Laboratory

The Doll Laboratory · Post by **The Doll Laboratory** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:52 am

Hello again,

briwri01 wrote:I really believe one of the simplest, cheapest, most effective mods that can be made is to simply give the dolls bigger feet so they can wear real, available footwear!!

Yes, this may be seen as a problem. All the Dolls have approximatively the same feet size, regardless of their size. On a 140 cm size Doll it may be alright, but on a 170 cm Doll it does look a bit strange.
But the feet have been modeled after the size of chinese women. And I suppose small feet are seen as cute and sexy there. Personally I wouldn’t mind if the size of Doll’s feet would be bigger as they could wear footwear available in shops.
If you are into high heels and adult shoes, the only way to buy something for small Doll’s feet is to buy from chinese websites like Aliexpress. There you will find every shoe style you want for your synthetic girl and in the right size. Believe me!

The Doll Laboratory

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:43 am

I like the teeth and tongue thing, my mission is to bring a awesome light weight functional skeletal system to the game. That is what I will do first. I will design it with silicone but I will ensure that it will work with tpe as well. Weight distribution will take me a few weeks to hammer out, then bells and whistles time. Believe it or not, several machine shops are willing to pro bono a lrip prod schedual.....

Post by **Tsall** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:44 am

My primary wish for a skeleton is durability. Especially the central element which holds legs and upper torso must be very durable. There are some reports where this element broke. In my opinion durability is more important then weight reduction.

I like the idea of adjustable joint stiffness. Or if this isn't possible, how about the ability to lock the joints? You asked about placing the charging port. As the power is needed in the body, not in the head I wouldn't place it behind the ears. As the head is detachable on most dolls (TPE and Silicone) I would place it on the neck. So detach head, charge. This way the charging port is invisible. If the wires are thin enough the head can be mounted while charging.

And as others have said:
- fingers
- bigger feet
- a hinged lower jaw (hard plastic is sufficient, no metal required)

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:51 am

Thank you!! Love the feedback! The adjustable joint stiffness is doable, and I will incorporate that. Challenge to actuate and manufacture under budget "butt" I think I have a way. Can be loose as a dead goose or like a statue with a special adjustment. And yes durable. My idea is near industructable. Budget constaints maybe but we will see

matt gloss · Post by **matt gloss** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:38 pm

Hi madmatter just want to wish you luck with your project

I am currently building a fabric doll and right from the start she was going to have real feet and also the joint optoin you spreak of,I am not fishing for your ideas at all and like me you may feel a bit top secret about things...

This was an early idea regarding the joint tightness,not mine really I remember seeing something like a folding trailer /caravan when I was small maybe 1970..
One disc is fixed,the tension for the joint is applied whilst the upper disc is out of the groove with a small spring between the two to help lift it back to tight again.On turning the upper disc it drops into the groove releasing the tension.

: DSCF7138.JPG (1.53 MiB) Viewed 848 times

: DSCF7139.JPG (1.27 MiB) Viewed 848 times

ATB

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:26 pm

Thanks Matt Gloss! yeah I have to be somewhat tight lipped, but your idea there is a feasible one! mine in more like a bike brake kind of thing (not really but closest thing I can think of) but the market is there, and WIDE open. We all win as dolls get better and more main stream....

my ultimate vision would be to have a skeleton that was so good, the outer "flesh" could be replaced at customer will, while the skeleton would last a lifetime or two. I do not know if I will make that, but it would be a great way to put more dolls out into consumers hands with more confidence. IMO anyway.

Sharing ideas and such is awesome!

maddmatter70 · Post by **maddmatter70** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:35 pm

Here is the outer reaches of my imagination......imagine buying a skeleton in a box that was a specialized maker bot contraption, swirling around the skeletal system applying very special higher grade TPE......if that could be made and sold as a kit at the right price, it would be awesome imo. very star trek

matt gloss · Post by **matt gloss** » Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:51 am

Yes opportunities exhist and I wish you success.
I intend on access flaps(excuse the pun)to adjust the tension on my fabric doll but using tpe/silicone you will most likely be going remotely operated.