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We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Got an idea? Need an invention?
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adelea
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by adelea »

Maviarab wrote:Screwfix direct (in the UK) would be far more efficient than using eBay.
I wasn't able to find anything on screwfix that appeared suitable, though I would love to be shown otherwise!

The smallest I could find was 3.5mm x 12mm (6ga x 1/2") .

ppjdog765
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by ppjdog765 »

Hi, first post. Great work!

I'd like to post a design suggestion here but... first post I can't upload images yet.. arghh

I'll be back :D

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by ppjdog765 »

OK, here goes...

Prepare to be amazed. JK, nothing groundbreaking here but here goes.

There are 2 tweaks I have in mind.

1. Modification to the internal structure to reduce the strain on the wire to make it last longer.
2. A tweak to the shape to prevent the fingers from bending backwards (and could be modified further to prevent bending side to side).

(pardon my crude 3D screenshots here, they're just for visualization purpose)

The first one tries to minimize the stress on the wire in a bent finger position.
01_ControlBend.jpg
01_ControlBend.jpg (20.81 KiB) Viewed 2020 times
If you spread the compression effect of the metal across a longer stretch of the wire you may increase the number of bends with wire can withstand.

Inside the phalange might look something like this:
02_InsideJoint.JPG
02_InsideJoint.JPG (23.02 KiB) Viewed 2020 times
The image is not completely correct as I have not hollowed out the volume that is displaced from the straight wire position to the curved position..

My Second idea is a protrusion of the form on either end like this:
03_Protrusions.JPG
03_Protrusions.JPG (19.38 KiB) Viewed 2020 times
And the resulting effect would be something like this:
04_StraightLocked.JPG
04_StraightLocked.JPG (17.32 KiB) Viewed 2020 times
05_Bent.JPG
05_Bent.JPG (18.39 KiB) Viewed 2020 times
I'm not accounting for many issues that would pop up during practical design. These are just the concepts. Plus I think you would need to wrap the fingers similar to the skeleton joints so that the tpe doesn't get ripped up in between the phalanges.

Thank you, g'night!

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MannequinFan
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

Hi Ppjdog,
Thanks for your input and welcome to TDF!

Actually your first idea is how I've got them designed. We are thinking alike! :thumbs_up:
In fact, that's the main reason for the dropped rounded ends - to give an extended curved surface for bending.
The phalanx edges need to be kept smooth and rounded though to prevent TPE damage, so I wouldn't want the sharp projecting ends like on your second graphic.
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phalanx design.jpg
phalanx design.jpg (135.05 KiB) Viewed 2016 times

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-Ragnar66-
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by -Ragnar66- »

MannequinFan wrote:Hi Ppjdog,
Thanks for your input and welcome to TDF!

Actually your first idea is how I've got them designed. We are thinking alike! :thumbs_up:
In fact, that's the main reason for the dropped rounded ends - to give an extended curved surface for bending.
The phalanx edges need to be kept smooth and rounded though to prevent TPE damage, so I wouldn't want the sharp projecting ends like on your second graphic.
Hey MannequinFan! You might take a look in this thread as well. viewtopic.php?f=388&t=116584 Although there´s not anything new to you, I´m as well highly interested in your new hand/finger design and would like to get solved my dolls hand/finger issues in hopefully not too distant future as well. 8) :glou:

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

Hey Ragnar thanks for the link. Looks like IT uses the typical plate and wrist bolt setup so this should probably work for your doll. The only issue I see is that the larger eye bolt may conflict with the socket head screw that holds the clevis on. The screw may have to be replaced with something more low profile like a button head.

I think it would be most helpful if we could somehow find out what all manufacturers use this setup...

Image


Meanwhile on the wire front...

I received the sample of 6491X wire yesterday which came from the UK.
It won't be the best but it will probably work. It doesn't have the clear nylon jacket like the THHN and it has only 7 strands that are thicker compared to the 19 thinner strands with the THHN. So it will pose nicely but probably won't have the stiffness for holding things like the THHN. Also it may not hold up as long having fewer strands.
It's just a hair thicker O.D. so the parts are more snug fitting, but still works OK...
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IMG_4779.JPG
IMG_4779.JPG (630.49 KiB) Viewed 1968 times

Dollicious2
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Dollicious2 »

Hi MF
The hands skeleton is such a exciting project.

My YL170 has loose wrists and a few disconnected finger wires as well.

Can you give a time frame how long till these can be purchased ?
And
Are any manufacturers interested in buying the Patent for this system?

DL2
viewtopic.php?t=104739
Jelina and Jelena 170cm C slim body twins.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DL2 Fashion Studio
viewtopic.php?t=116236
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Olinka YL170 D
viewtopic.php?t=93693

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

Dollicious2 wrote:Can you give a time frame how long till these can be purchased ?
And
Are any manufacturers interested in buying the Patent for this system?
DL2 thanks. I'm looking at next week to finish up the package for Shapeways.
I've got other things going on as well so I can't just focus on this exclusively.
I'm not sure yet if this would even work with the manufacturing process let alone be patented.

I posted some questions for IT in this thread, but no response so far...
viewtopic.php?p=1538457#p1538457

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by -Ragnar66- »

MannequinFan wrote:
Dollicious2 wrote:Can you give a time frame how long till these can be purchased ?
And
Are any manufacturers interested in buying the Patent for this system?
I'm looking at next week to finish up the package for Shapeways.
I've got other things going on as well so I can't just focus on this exclusively.
I'm not sure yet if this would even work with the manufacturing process let alone be patented.

I posted some questions for IT in this thread, but no response so far...
viewtopic.php?p=1538457#p1538457
the IT guys appear very busy ATM. Working on new doll or anything, who knows. Hope you get it going, whoever will bite at last. 8)

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Dollicious2 »

-Ragnar66- wrote:
MannequinFan wrote:
Dollicious2 wrote:Can you give a time frame how long

the IT guys appear very busy ATM. Working on new doll or anything, who knows. Hope you get it going, whoever will bite at last. 8)
Hello Ragnar69
And
Thank you MF :thumbs_up:

I believe MF is correct that the doll manufacturers won't be interested as it raises costs and difficulty in making the dolls and if they had to buy a patent for a design they'll just never do that in the 1st place.
If anything they'd just copy the design as they have nothing to fear from international lawsuits which they cannot be threatened by.

It's up to the doll owners.

I've seen IT is in the process of building a cartoon character doll yes... to each their own.
DL2
viewtopic.php?t=104739
Jelina and Jelena 170cm C slim body twins.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DL2 Fashion Studio
viewtopic.php?t=116236
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Olinka YL170 D
viewtopic.php?t=93693

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adelea
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by adelea »

The wire finally arrived in the UK after spending a while in customs - and had been opened and examined. I guess a spool of wire is suspicious!

I received the customs charge card today from Royal Mail, and have just been to collect it.

The wire cost £42.87 including postage, and a customs charge of £12.34, so call it £55, so £5.50/5 foot length.

If anyone wants a 1/10 share send me a PM and I will give you my paypal address. It's more expensive than the 6491X wire MF has tested, but it's also a bit stiffer and is what he has used to test.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Maviarab »

adelea wrote:The wire finally arrived in the UK after spending a while in customs - and had been opened and examined. I guess a spool of wire is suspicious!

I received the customs charge card today from Royal Mail, and have just been to collect it.

The wire cost £42.87 including postage, and a customs charge of £12.34, so call it £55, so £5.50/5 foot length.

If anyone wants a 1/10 share send me a PM and I will give you my paypal address. It's more expensive than the 6491X wire MF has tested, but it's also a bit stiffer and is what he has used to test.
You know what the use wire in right? There's a reason (and good one) it was opened.

As for costs...sure mate...pop me your paypal addy and I'll sort that out sometime this week.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Zippy81 »

Hey MF, would like snappable pieces be an option instead of using wires maybe? Something like this:
snap pieces.jpg
Just wondering!

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by jeramos20 »

Panther68 wrote:Well, look what's arrived. Anastasia likes that the plates match her evening gown.
Yes, she has been in the same dress for 5 weeks, now. Better than her wearing sweat pants. Off work, tomorrow and it will be a rainy day. Tomorrow will be a good time for installation. Wish us luck.


hello what a beautiful doll that model is? what brand and what size is it would interest me one so it is very beautiful.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by jeramos20 »

MannequinFan wrote:Hey thanks everyone for your kind comments, and a special HUGE thanks to Panther for allowing Anastasia to be the guinea pig for this project.
I'm really happy things have gone this well so far. :D

I was working on eye sets yesterday so I kind of missed the big finale.
Photos like this are what keep me going in this hobby...

Image

Thanks so much for posting this Panther, that really made my day!

Image

hello what a beautiful doll that model is? What brand and what size is it that I would be interested in, is it so beautiful and how do you make that smile?

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