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We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

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Dutch_Husband
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Dutch_Husband »

Great job, MF!

I have been wondering about the wire for some time now myself.
I stumbled across a couple websites for jewelry wire that discuss "field working" or "field hardening" of wire.
https://jewelrytutorialhq.com/work-harden-jewelry-wire/
https://www.ehow.com/how_5962740_harden ... welry.html

What I got from this is that as wire is twisted and bent, it hardens making it more resistant to future twists and bends, until the wire finally breaks.
With your great design, the bends are focused at the knuckles, as they should be. But I wonder if it is stressing those points of the wire more.
Copper is a soft metal, so twisting (like the factory stock finger wires) adds some hardness to hold position, but makes them more likely to break with use.

Have you looked into using a different metal?
I was playing around with a wire coat hanger. I think it is steel, is quite stiff so will hold a pose and is hard to break by bending.
The downside is that if the wire is too stiff, we run the risk of poke-through. But I think your invention would prevent that, while providing "leverage" to allow for easy posing.

Any thoughts?
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Tsall »

adelea wrote:Teflon covered is no good - the glue will not stick to it.
Good point.

I did more research on AWG 14/19 and found this:

Double-walled stranded-wire, AWG 14/19, 0.361 mm, white
https://www.buerklin.com/en/p/91F5141
Manufacturer: Raychem
Product number: 44A0111-14-9
Country of origin: UK
Specs: https://www.buerklin.com/medias/sys_mas ... hment=true
Minimum order quantity: 1000 :(

Sadly I can't find any website selling this per meter. But maybe someone in UK has more luck.
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by adelea »

This stuff is 'spec 44' which from what I can gather means 44 strands inside.

From my discussions with MF, he has concerns about the number of strands - and isn't sure of their longevity.

I had found this:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/THINWALL-2-0 ... 896dd68b77

Which has 28 strands, and MF wasn't sure how well it work. The stuff he is using (and that I bought 50' of) has 19 strands.

I believe he was going to try some of the automotive wire to see how it holds up - hopefully he will chime in!

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

Hey Tsall and DH thanks for your input.

DH, coat hanger wire would definitely be much too stiff and would probably break sooner than stranded wire with a lot of bending. Stranded wire will last longer than solid, mainly because with the same bending radius, each small strand will bend much more gently in proportion to its thickness than one big one. The 14 AWG THHN Cerrowire I'm using is working quite well. It has just the right amount of stiffness to hold a strong pose but still flexible enough to stay durable for quite a while. The problem we're having is finding an equivalent product that's readily available in Europe.

Tsall,
Wow that's really thin wire for 14 AWG. Only 2.26mm O.D. compared to 2.8mm for the Cerrowire so it may be a little too loose fit.
It looks like 6491X wire or "conduit wire" is common and available by the meter online. It's used for the same purpose as the THHN wire here which is for pulling through conduit and general hook up wiring in buildings. It's generally just called "building wire" here. It has the same O.D. 2.8mm.
I ordered a 3' sample so we'll see how it works. Here's the link again...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/6491X-Electric ... NsVTUm6OMA

Can anyone over there tell me if this 6491X conduit wire is something you can just pick up at a DIY store?
Here you can buy building wire by the foot or in small spools at a Home Depot or Lowes so it's really cheap.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

adelea wrote: I believe he was going to try some of the automotive wire to see how it holds up - hopefully he will chime in!
Just did a test with some automotive wire I got at Home Depot today.
It poses but is way too soft and noodle like to be any good unfortunately. :(
It's the 16AWG Cerrowire "primary wire" which has 26 strands. The 14 AWG has the 41 strands and is a little too big O.D.
I'm hoping the 6491X conduit cable will be the ticket for the European market as it is used for the same purpose as the THHN.
I should be getting my sample at the end of the month. Gotta get back on eyes this weekend!

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Maviarab »

MannequinFan wrote:6mm/323748596731?hash=item4b60eb8bfb:m:mvH4R4BxDvBtyNsVTUm6OMA[/url]

Can anyone over there tell me if this 6491X conduit wire is something you can just pick up at a DIY store?
Here you can buy building wire by the foot or in small spools at a Home Depot or Lowes so it's really cheap.
Yes you can from a few places.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by ILuvFemsNlingerie »

The reason I asked about if they can be already assembled is that I'm terrible at putting something together like this lol.

I don't need any right now but if I did I would have trouble putting them together. Now my brother definitely needs a set because all the fingers except one thumb are broken on his YL 148 doll but not sure when he'll buy tthese.
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

ILuvFemsNlingerie wrote:The reason I asked about if they can be already assembled is that I'm terrible at putting something together like this lol.
Keep in mind even if they are assembled, there is also the surgery involved with this and the seal up afterward.
Are you up to doing that?

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

Alright folks, got a little more work to do with this. The adhesive just isn't working very well with the Shapeways parts. With just a little twisting the small phalanx on the index finger came loose.
With the ABS it welds to the wire nicely but not with the nylon material.

So the phalanges will need to be fastened with the small sheet metal screws (#4x1/4 or M2.9x6.5) that drive thru the wire, similar to how it works at the palm plate. Not real pretty, but this may make assembly a little easier anyway. I'll probably have the screws on the palm side though, not on the side of the fingers as as shown.
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by -Ragnar66- »

MannequinFan wrote:Alright folks, got a little more work to do with this. The adhesive just isn't working very well with the Shapeways parts. With just a little twisting the small phalanx on the index finger came loose.
With the ABS it welds to the wire nicely but not with the nylon material.

So the phalanges will need to be fastened with the small sheet metal screws (#4x1/4 or M2.9x6.5) that drive thru the wire, similar to how it works at the palm plate. Not real pretty, but this may make assembly a little easier anyway. I'll probably have the screws on the palm side though, not on the side of the fingers as as shown.
Lots of fiddling for sure. Does not need to look pretty if it works and fits into the fingers without harming the TPE/Silcone during any bends and poses.

otherwise.... :thumbs_up: 8)

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by adelea »

MannequinFan wrote:Alright folks, got a little more work to do with this. The adhesive just isn't working very well with the Shapeways parts. With just a little twisting the small phalanx on the index finger came loose.
With the ABS it welds to the wire nicely but not with the nylon material.

So the phalanges will need to be fastened with the small sheet metal screws (#4x1/4 or M2.9x6.5) that drive thru the wire, similar to how it works at the palm plate. Not real pretty, but this may make assembly a little easier anyway. I'll probably have the screws on the palm side though, not on the side of the fingers as as shown.
Would a different glue make a difference do you think?

If not, and more screws are needed - it's what, 2 extra per finger? So 15 per hand, 30 total?

Do you think a recess could be made in the rounded part at the end of the bones and have the screw mount in there?

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by MannequinFan »

adelea wrote: Would a different glue make a difference do you think?

If not, and more screws are needed - it's what, 2 extra per finger? So 15 per hand, 30 total?

Do you think a recess could be made in the rounded part at the end of the bones and have the screw mount in there?
Now that I think on this more the screws will be better than glue. It will make assembly much easier.
I'll explain that later.
This link I posted on the last page are the screws you need. 40 would be the perfect amount.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M2-9x6-5mm-3 ... GTR=1#shId

The round part at the end is where the wire needs to move (like a hinge) so you wouldn't want a screw there to hold the wire.

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by ILuvFemsNlingerie »

Yeah with the hands already assembled the surgery seems like it would be the easy part.
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Custom SM 168C (will be awhile)
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Heads: WM #58 (Ce Ce), YL Lori (Dahlia), 6yE N24 (Veronica), SM #55 (Asami), DS April (April), IronTech LP (Lucinda), Matedoll #21 (Cindy), WM #234 (Minka) #363 (Victoria)

All via BCD (Jeff is the man)

CeCe's and friends thread
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April's thread
viewtopic.php?f=143&t=89211

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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Tsall »

Wouldn't countersunk screws be better? They might disappear completely into the material. Or screws without head, then the thread is not shortened by the countersunk head. Just an idea.
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Re: We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

Post by Tyr »

Here are a couple of photos of my attempt at hand plates. The fingers aren't trimmed to length yet but you get the idea. Wire is 14awg stripped and re covered with heat shrink tubing, brass tubing and a continuous sheath of heat shrink over the top.
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I've used red crimp bullet connectors stripped and soldered to the wires as fingertips, I've tinned the free ends and hold them to the palm plates with hexagonal standoffs and 3mm grub screws. The brass tube should insert into the palm plate on final assembly,(the right thumb has been trimmed) provided the wires are the right length! Even if the core wires break the heat shrink should keep it all together, anyway, theoretically the fingers are replaceable, so I could always make a replacement :whistle: It's getting close to the time where I'll have to open Ami up, I just hope that there aren't any nasty surprises inside. I have some contingency plans if I dont find what I'm expecting. I'm not looking forward to it to be honest. I don't think Ami will be able to hold anything, but she should be able to hold a pose.

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