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WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

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Dollypeg2018
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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Dollypeg2018 »

Muninn wrote:I think the Forum's stance on this is fair enough. I won't go into the ins and outs of how best to do it, but as a community we need to distance ourselves from the illegal/morally dodgy parts of the sex doll world.

As for ageing a doll, I think this site has been mentioned before, possibly by Haremlover? - How Old? From that link, my doll is between 20 and 29, depending on hair, makeup, etc.
Only by chance did I come across sex dolls after researching robot servants. Then I saw these adult dolls. The first impression was 158cm hgt at 32kg or 70Lbs is very heavy. Why cant these be made lighter. One concern is the number of child like dolls that for me should be banned. Having discovered so many mfrs and designs it is difficult to choose one that ideally is portable and can be handled easily. 140cm to 158cm 25kg or 50Lbs max. If someone could produce them at sensible weights then that would be ideal. Regarding the UK customs they are hot on small models as they should be for obvious reasons. So what is a legal height for importing or buying one of these.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by nicvncnt »

lovingdolz wrote:how anybody can make a piece of rubber illegal is beyond me
With respect that is like saying how can anyone make a piece of metal illegal....how about if the piece of metal is in the form of a lethal weapon?

We're not talking about raw pieces of rubber/plastic/silicone but what they have been made to represent.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Snoman99 »

I'm considering getting a second doll. I prefer the smaller (mini) ones for maintenance, storage, and weight. I don't want to hurt myself moving a doll. I've been eyeing a 108cm L-cup on SDP's site. I don't think she looks young but she is short. Its hard to know what people will think these days.

Thanks for the support TDF and members :D

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Slew »

nicvncnt wrote:
lovingdolz wrote:how anybody can make a piece of rubber illegal is beyond me
With respect that is like saying how can anyone make a piece of metal illegal....how about if the piece of metal is in the form of a lethal weapon?

We're not talking about raw pieces of rubber/plastic/silicone but what they have been made to represent.
Well said nicvncnt.

I know that some might be tempted to counter with: "but guns actually hurt people", well I think the analogy is still a good one because it points out that raw materials are irrelevant within a discussion about the ethical effect of a final product.


Well, on-topic is 'age estimation', but even if this is a little off-topic, I think it's a really important distinction people should be making. :thumbs_up:

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Quantum »

Well, if TDF staff are gonna go off topic:

The analogy is still shitty because there's plenty of evidence a chunk of metal in the form of a lethal weapon is, well, you know, lethal; but jack all evidence that a chunk of rubber is detrimental to society or individuals in any way. I've said it before, I'll say it again: if dolls in the shape of children promote child abuse, then dolls in the shape of women promote rape and sexual abuse against women. If you're not willing to admit to the latter, then admitting to the former is hypocritical.

The question should be: "how could anybody make a piece of rubber illegal when there's no justifiable reason to do so..."

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Slew »

Quantum wrote:Well, if TDF staff are gonna go off topic:

The analogy is still shitty because there's plenty of evidence a chunk of metal in the form of a lethal weapon is, well, you know, lethal; but jack all evidence that a chunk of rubber is detrimental to society or individuals in any way. I've said it before, I'll say it again: if dolls in the shape of children promote child abuse, then dolls in the shape of women promote rape and sexual abuse against women. If you're not willing to admit to the latter, then admitting to the former is hypocritical.

The question should be: "how could anybody make a piece of rubber illegal when there's no justifiable reason to do so..."
I recognise your frustration Quantum, it's a complicated issue.

However, your boolean formula suggests that all dolls must have an automatic connection to the promotion/representation of heinous crimes, or more specifically that if one set does then so does the other. But while they do promote sexualising the adult human physique, sex dolls shaped like adults don't inherently promote any crimes, heinous or otherwise. If you take "adult" out of the equation then you have something which in the public eye would naturally be seen as promoting/representing heinous crimes.

An adult doll represents adult sexual activity which is legally sound and generally acceptable outside of church, whereas the child counterpart represents something wholly other and completely unacceptable.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Nescio50 »

Please understand that TDF doesn't make the law, TDF has to comply to the law in Canada, and also compliance to the laws in other Western countries is important to us.

That's why we don't discuss if underage looking dolls should be allowed on TDF -they are not allowed. We discuss best ways of age estimation, that's what this thread is about.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Quantum »

Slew wrote:...sex dolls shaped like adults don't inherently promote any crimes, heinous or otherwise.
Neither do sex dolls shaped like children. The inherent promotion of the crime in question is dependent on whether consent (informed or otherwise) is involved. Because consent is irrelevent when dealing with inanimate objects, no promotion of crime is inherent. Opponents of the production and sale of these dolls would have one to believe they do in fact promote crime. This has to be demonstrated. It would be a great error to prohibit a potential therapy for individuals who have heinous desires in an effort to reduce abuse on the basis of emotion and paranoia. It is a very easy slippery slope to go from banning mannequins because they are perceived to be obscene to banning other forms of media on the basis of obscenity.
Slew wrote:If you take "adult" out of the equation then you have something which in the public eye would naturally be seen as promoting/representing heinous crimes.
Ought a product be prohibited on the basis of popular disgust or on the basis of research and reliable evidence? The answer should be obvious.
Nescio50 wrote:Please understand that TDF doesn't make the law, TDF has to comply to the law in Canada, and also compliance to the laws in other Western countries is important to us.
I understand and respect that these dolls aren't allowed on TDF. It's perfectly reasonable to respect and comply with the law of your jurisdiction.
Nescio50 wrote:That's why we don't discuss if underage looking dolls should be allowed on TDF -they are not allowed. We discuss best ways of age estimation, that's what this thread is about.
I merely wish TDF staff wouldn't chime in on these issues. Moderate the discussion, don't have a bias on it. Slew seemed to suggest there was some question about the ethical effect of dolls. As far as I'm concerned there is none. The question of the ethical effect of dolls should only be raised when any effect can be demonstrated at all. This shouldn't even be an issue. It's nothing but fear mongering. It's sort of like raising the question of IQ differences between races. Sure, you can point to differences, but what's the point in bringing the question up?

And it's pretty clear this thread isn't going anywhere anyway.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by rubherkitty »

Quantum wrote: SNIP:
I merely wish TDF staff wouldn't chime in on these issues. Moderate the discussion, don't have a bias on it.
I assume a large majority of TDF members will agree it is silly to regulate what form of rubber a person wishes to own in private. I will also assume that a large majority of TDF members have no interest in child like dolls. And since this site is dedicated to dolls that appear and are presented as 18yrs old or older, the discussion of the issue pro or con is moot.

One who wished to discuss the issue either pro or con should find or establish a web site dedicated for that. Form a PAC, lobby congress. Since the dolls in question have no place here the topic need not even be here either. About like having a special section to argue over the best chainsaw or airline service.... on a adult doll forum??
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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by jbl182 »

I respect the forum rules. But this thread makes me sad. I love my dolls.
~~~I do not love my dolls because they replace a human.~~~
~~~I love my dolls because they are dolls.~~~

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Slew »

Quantum wrote:
Slew wrote:...sex dolls shaped like adults don't inherently promote any crimes, heinous or otherwise.
Neither do sex dolls shaped like children.

Yeah I got it, you can't be reasoned with.


I'm not a panel moderator for political debates who may sit the chair quietly and only interrupt when needed, but instead say what's on my mind..

I'm sorry my logic mystifies you. :drinking:

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Nescio50 »

Quantum wrote:I merely wish TDF staff wouldn't chime in on these issues. Moderate the discussion, don't have a bias on it.
Please remember that all at staff are members too, volunteers running this place.
Speaking for myself, I try to be withholding posting personal opinions, especially in threads like this.
But I wouldn't like a situation in which joining staff would mean never to be able to join discussions, that would be wrong.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Maviarab »

Slew seemed to suggest there was some question about the ethical effect of dolls. As far as I'm concerned there is none.
Going to chime in here with something not recently touched upon:

Firstly, that is 'your' opinion, just like others have theirs. But bottom line (and secondly) the only opinions that matters are the governments of the world who quite frankly...and very firmly, disagree with your opinion (be that rightly or wrongly). You wish to argue the case with them, the very best of luck to you friend.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by Quantum »

rubherkitty wrote:One who wished to discuss the issue either pro or con should find or establish a web site dedicated for that. Form a PAC, lobby congress. Since the dolls in question have no place here the topic need not even be here either. About like having a special section to argue over the best chainsaw or airline service.... on a adult doll forum??
There are many topics on this forum that have nothing to do with adult dolls. This is a pinned announcement that is displayed in every subforum.
Slew wrote:Yeah I got it, you can't be reasoned with.
I don't understand why you think I can't be reasoned with. You take a snippet out of a paragraph that you disagree with and somehow I'm unreasonable? Sounds reasonable. Do you need the argument as a syllogism?

The inherent promotion of crime is dependent on whether the affected participants (children) are referenced in that promotion.
Sex dolls are not the affected participants (children).
Therefore, sex dolls cannot inherently promote crime.

Where's the fault in the argument?
Slew wrote:I'm not a panel moderator for political debates who may sit the chair quietly and only interrupt when needed, but instead say what's on my mind..
Nescio50 wrote:But I wouldn't like a situation in which joining staff would mean never to be able to join discussions, that would be wrong.
I don't mean for it to come off as though I'm demanding anyone not join in on the discussion. This is your forum, not mine. But do you not believe it is the responsibility of forum administrators or anybody who holds a platform, particularily one which holds a monopoly on the discussion, to refrain from using their writing to sway public opinion on apparently no basis? If you don't, I'll leave the discussion here and cease further response.

As far as I can tell, there is no basis to suggest an ethical effect from dolls. Just personal disgust.
Maviarab wrote:Firstly, that is 'your' opinion, just like others have theirs.
Generally, when someone leads with "seemed" and "as far as I'm concerned", they're stating their opinion.

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Re: WARNING: To buyers of young looking dolls

Post by rubherkitty »

Quantum, No matter how valid your point may be or not, for the most part, no one here has any interest is debating the topic. The legal right or not, to manufacture or own such a doll has no interest here as TDF has no interest is such dolls. TDF only desires to make the pass or fail distinction of a doll, not debate the legal or moral issues of owning such dolls. If it passes it will be allowed, if not, it's gone.
Yes, this issue is a stickied announcement and is a set rule and not open to debate.
You can do anything you want, with anything you desire, in the privacy of your own home. We just don't want to know about it.

Now if there is ever a call to ban adult dolls, I'm sure the discussion will get top billing.
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