First time posting disagreements with polices with Aybss

Richbeachgoer · Post by **Richbeachgoer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:12 pm

Hello everyone out there in the Doll Forium. This is the first time posting a topic. Its very nice sometimes when you can exercise your freedom of speech. I always liked the Real Dolls of thier beatiful woman dolls and they havve such a large selection to choose from comapred to the other doll manufactures. I do disagree with some of the polices that they go by. When you give all of the money up front you are kind of at the mercy of what Abyss decisions are. I just had masonery work done on my house. And there are plenty of other people who treats thier customers as though you are very important to them and the customer is always right with in reason. The masonery guy dose not want me to give him a penny till the work is complete. He has to go out and buy material to do the job before the customer pays him anyhting. When you have a buisness like Abyss, I am not saying they are a bad buiness, but when you give 6500 dollars all up front before you even see your product it makes you on edge weather if Abyss will come thru satisfactory for you. Its like going to the casinos and thinking I am taking a chance with alot money to win something big. People like guareentees and they arent any guareentees at all with abyss and I guess other doll comapnies are very simular. Another rule is I asked them to double check any defaults with the doll before they stick it in the crate and ship it off to your adress. They denied me to double check before they ship to you. They told me that they have a inspection team that dose that and we dont double any defaults. You hear all of the time about car maufactures or any other maufacture they honestly over look things and you discover it once you have recieved your product. I dont think it would take too much trouble to double check for any defaults right before they ship. When someone tells you that they dont double check thier product , it seems to you that they realy dont care if it dose have defaults because they recieved all of their money up front. I am not saying they dont care but that gives you the impression they dont care. I see the doll matrix and you see all of the dolls that people own. Real doll is so popular they leave every other doll manufacture in the dust of how many each doll maufacture has on the Fourm . It seems that they have a manopaly who the whole buisneses that is out there. I can say alot people who who did buy Real Dolls realy has alot of trust and faith in them. I am the type that I have to know them a little before I put my total faith and trust in for someone or some company. Thanks for listining to my problem with Abyss. Hey I see Dottie all of the time. She is certainly a very gorgess doll to look at. If I were ever to get a Real Doll I certainly would want to have her sister when ordering the doll. So thanks for everybodies time

flavortang · Post by **flavortang** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:47 pm

Paragraphs. Learn them.

silicomorphos · Post by **silicomorphos** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:57 pm

Welcome to the Doll forum Richbeachgoer .
This post should be transfered to RD forum or to Doll forum in general

Finaly a thread related to consumer's questions and thoughts,rather posts of social brown noising and replies from un-aware followers who are playing just the "game" of public relationships and career establishment of the original posters.

Back to the original post,Abyss isnt the only hi-end silicone company,requaring the total amount in front,before production.Since every doll is in a way ,a custom creation of options,manufacturers require the total amount before the doll gets into the production pipe-line.

Unfortunately,the small market of hi-end dolls,doesnt have the power to change the dynamics,of customers been at the "mercy" of the manufacturer's rules and requlations.
Things are much better now, than how they use to be 5-6 yrears ago.
The only hope is ,that as more manufacturers get into the hi-end silicone doll buisness,and as the competition more and more will rise in this small size market ,companies use to monopolize ,will face the need to change stragety,customers services and product offers,to continue be in the game.
TDF has helped at the past ,into this direction, IMO could have become much more active and catalytic regarding consumers informations and feedback,making its self a powerful factor in manufacturers product quality,customer service etch.
But unfortunately that requires a much more mature behaivor and approach of members.

Paragraphs. Learn them.

Let me repeat:
But unfortunately that requires a much more mature behaivor and approach of members.

silis

Campdaan · Post by **Campdaan** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:59 pm

Richbeachgoer wrote:Hello everyone out there in the Doll Forum...
Hey I see Dottie all of the time. She is certainly a very gorgess doll to look at. If I were ever to get a Real Doll I certainly would want to have her sister when ordering the doll. So thanks for everybodies time

Hi Richbeachgoer,

It's an Honor when someone wants a Doll like Dottie.

Abyss, as all the other Doll Manufacturers are Custom Making each Doll for their owner. Because of the Time and Craftsmanship involved, By paying the full price upfront, You are actually securing your space in the line of production.

It's always been that way, and Abyss has never missed delivery on a Doll.

If you find the price to be a bit out of your Range, You have several options in Manufacturers, And may consider adopting a Pre-Owned Doll.

Dottie was adopted by me, She is the PERFECT SpokesDoll for Doll-Adoption.

Good Luck in your Quest.

And please... Use that SPACEBAR !

mahtek · Post by **mahtek** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:10 pm

I agree, Silicomorphos, moved to Realdoll.

I can see your point, Richbeachgoer, to ask for a double inspection should be an option on an all custom doll like a RD. As each step in any process adds cost, they should be able to fix a reasonable price for that service.

Abyss has a fine track record for replacing dolls that do make it to the customer with defects. So long as it is within 24 hours of delivery, and it hasn't been taken for a test drive(sex).

You are the final inspector. Check the appearance of the doll, unclothed front and back. Touch the doll all over to be sure that the foam cores are properly aligned. Test each joint to be sure that it functions properly. If any problems are found contact Abyss first! The forum can wait for any news. If there's a problem, send it back and they will make it right.

Mahtek & his Ladies

indigo · Post by **indigo** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:34 pm

This seems to be an ongoing argument. You have to understand a lot of labor and materials goes into these dolls. These are also luxury items so the market is limited. If Abyss or any other company changed the policy so you could get your doll started with say $2000, sure sales might increase but there will be that percentage who will change their mind and cancel midway through the process. So all the spent labor and materials become a loss to the company.
That and let's say I am a guy who has paid in full for my doll but now I'm having to wait for some schmo who partially paid. Then that guy cancels. So instead of the artist working on my doll which I have already paid in full for, the artist just wasted a month producing a doll for someone else who ended up cancelling.

It opens up too many problems and headaches for the companies most of which only have a handful of people at most. Look, if you really want a doll start putting aside a few dollars every week. Open a savings account just for this. It took me over a year to save for my girl. Besides it's a win win because while you are saving you might decide not to go through with it and you will have that saved money ready to spend on something else.

As for the quality checks, most of the things you buy these days you don't get to check until it arrives at your door. Doesn't matter if it's a mega computer, furniture, or a pair of panties off some website. So their policy seems to be in line with 90% of the marketplace. You are buying a product (a doll) not a service (like masonry work). Not saying asking for a double inspection is wrong, it could be an added service you pay for but unfortunately they don't do that right now. One of these companies should pick up on this because they could easily make a bit more money off each doll with a pre-shipping inspection service.

silicomorphos · Post by **silicomorphos** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:40 pm

So their policy seems to be in line with 90% of the marketplace

Dear indigo
check their return policy...we should not simplify everything.

Final inspections would obligated the companies to send outside of their doors only mint condition dolls...and in this forum we have seen lots of "mistakes" from their side.

Conky · Post by **Conky** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:22 pm

welcome Richbeachgoer! (what a name, i love it!!! Hee Hee Heee!!!!)

It would be nice to know more about Abyss's pre-shipping quality assurance procedures. some good verbage about that on their website could work wonders for them really, i'm sure many potential buyers have had the same concerns as you. not sure about needing a second check, but it does seem a little odd to me that they wouldn't humor you (probably a legal thing, like agreeing to a second contract or something).

but, if a skilled doll-maker fom the studio inspects each doll for 15 minutes to make sure everything is in working order before it's packaged & shipped i'm not worried about a second check. if they miss something on the 1st check it probably wasn't a very good check. rather than slap another rushed inspection on the doll i'd prefer one good quality inspection which is what i hope Abyss already does.

on the other hand........i know the horror stories of damaged dolls arriving stand out on the forums when we read them, but i have read a few, and i'd be lying if i said they don't worry me as i wait fo my doll to arrive.

hilltrot · Post by **hilltrot** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:41 pm

Very , very few contractors will allow you to pay after they do the work on your house. If you want repairs on a house or a new sun room, they will usually ask for cash, not check, prior to the work being done.

You got very lucky and got a very rare contractor. That is not how they usually do business.

I agree with Abyss's policy of payment ahead of time. I don't see any other way of doing their particular business.

There is a bright side to asking for the money ahead of time before seeing the final product. People are less likely spend money they don't have in the dolls.

As far as cars. Millions of people buy cars every year. Even in this bad economy. Abyss and other doll makers only wish that were true about dolls.

indigo · Post by **indigo** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:17 am

silicomorphos wrote:
So their policy seems to be in line with 90% of the marketplace
Dear indigo
check their return policy...we should not simplify everything.

Final inspections would obligated the companies to send outside of their doors only mint condition dolls...and in this forum we have seen lots of "mistakes" from their side.

No one is simplifying anything. Fact is these are sex toys and a lot of high end sex toys are not returnable because they cannot be resold. When they leave the door there is nothing to stop the recipient from taking the doll, using it, then poking a hole in it or breaking a joint, repackaging the thing and sending it back saying it was broken when the truth is they just didn't like it in which case the manufacturer is stuck. There are a lot of people who would abuse a liberal return policy just go to any big store and check out their return register. Majority of that stuff being returned was used and the purchaser didn't like it so they make up some excuse to return it so the store will accept it. I know I worked returns many years ago when at least a few people in society were decent unlike today where no one gives a piss about anyone but themself especially in US.

deusbot · Post by **deusbot** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:48 am

Maybe one thing that would be both interesting and clear up process issues would be a something like a 30 minute YouTube on "The making of a Doll", showing all the steps AND inspections. Getting a better feel for what's going into each doll might make people feel they are getting their moneys worth. All sort of manufacturers have total quality management propaganda, why not for dolls? One of the things you can do with the labor based house contractor is you can see what they are doing by just looking at your house. And you can visit Abyss and take a shop tour. You can sign up for one on their website (or used to), and to cost was deducted from any purchase. Maybe a full shop tour on YouTube would help others who aren't in the neighborhood, without giving away any trade secrets that a shop visitor wouldn't see.

Conky · Post by **Conky** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:15 am

hilltrot wrote:Very , very few contractors will allow you to pay after they do the work on your house. If you want repairs on a house or a new sun room, they will usually ask for cash, not check, prior to the work being done.

You got very lucky and got a very rare contractor. That is not how they usually do business.

any project much bigger than a simple house repair would probably warrant a contract between the contractor and the owner wherein the owner would release portions of money to the contractor for work completed. in most construction contracts, the owner typical holds onto a retainage until the work is 100% complete. there is no way a contractor gets paid 100% up front for building a home while the lot is empty. come to think of i've never paid a contractor up front for any of the work i've had done on my house. i'm in the construction industry, i would never ever recommend giving a contractor cash before the work was complete, yipes!!!

that being said, abyss creating a doll is not a good comparison. doll-makers can't get paid in stages based on level of completion when the bulk of the cost is over after they start pouring. not to mention the fact that once you pour the silicone its too late to turn back. i don't argue with abyss's method of payment at all, but all products should have a level of guarantee reflective of the price you're paying, which i don't think abyss has a problem with. seems like they stand behind their products and customer service pretty well.

hilltrot wrote: I agree with Abyss's policy of payment ahead of time. I don't see any other way of doing their particular business.

absolutely. i don't see any other way either. some people would simply not pay after they received their doll, the price of dolls would go up as a result, and then they'd probably go out of business.

deusbot wrote:Maybe one thing that would be both interesting and clear up process issues would be a something like a 30 minute YouTube on "The making of a Doll", showing all the steps AND inspections.

that would be great!

be sure to check out what doppler just posted:

http://dollforum.com/modules.php?name=F ... 185#268185

indigo wrote: I know I worked returns many years ago when at least a few people in society were decent unlike today where no one gives a piss about anyone but themself especially in US.

Hey!

i care about people and i live in the US.

Richbeachgoer · Post by **Richbeachgoer** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:58 am

Someone was saying if Abyss was to double check on thier product, it would take 20 minutes to check things over and they cant afford to do that to everyone. Well I remember Fox News with thier news clip that they said they produce one doll a day. That means at the end of the day who ever puts the dolls in the crate for ship might stay an extra 15 minutes looking it over. If you have 2 people looking it over then its only 7 and half minutes. Or if you have 3 people that would only be 3 and half minutes. They cant aforrd 3 and half minutes from 3 employees giving the doll a double check? Hey guys you are talking about someone dishing out 6500 dollars. Another thing, when you buy a brand new house you are talking about alot more then 6500 dollars. You are talking about one hundred thousand dollars and beyond. When the contractor who makes a aggreement with the seller they negociate for a settlement. The contractor wont lower his price but, he will throw in a couple of goodies with the deal. Sometimes you see them throw in a pool with a real low cost. So back to Abyss , you mean to tell me they cant spare 3 and half minutes from 3 employees to double check on the doll before they put it in the crate. Give me a break. Maybe they are scared that they will see a default and that will delay shipping the doll, and also cost more for the repairs of the doll once it is completed. They say they have someone inspect them, but you know that saying, no one is perfect. A 3 and minute double check certainly would not hurt

Post by **Abyss** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:21 pm

To be honest with you Rich your post doesn't make much sense and these kinds of posts really make me suspicious to whose really posting them. Especially since you have 2 total posts. Please email me your name and order number and who was helping you at Abyss ASAP so I can help resolve any issues you have had.

-Joe
joe@realdoll.com

Richbeachgoer wrote:Hello everyone out there in the Doll Forium. This is the first time posting a topic. Its very nice sometimes when you can exercise your freedom of speech. I always liked the Real Dolls of thier beatiful woman dolls and they havve such a large selection to choose from comapred to the other doll manufactures. I do disagree with some of the polices that they go by. When you give all of the money up front you are kind of at the mercy of what Abyss decisions are. I just had masonery work done on my house. And there are plenty of other people who treats thier customers as though you are very important to them and the customer is always right with in reason. The masonery guy dose not want me to give him a penny till the work is complete. He has to go out and buy material to do the job before the customer pays him anyhting. When you have a buisness like Abyss, I am not saying they are a bad buiness, but when you give 6500 dollars all up front before you even see your product it makes you on edge weather if Abyss will come thru satisfactory for you. Its like going to the casinos and thinking I am taking a chance with alot money to win something big. People like guareentees and they arent any guareentees at all with abyss and I guess other doll comapnies are very simular. Another rule is I asked them to double check any defaults with the doll before they stick it in the crate and ship it off to your adress. They denied me to double check before they ship to you. They told me that they have a inspection team that dose that and we dont double any defaults. You hear all of the time about car maufactures or any other maufacture they honestly over look things and you discover it once you have recieved your product. I dont think it would take too much trouble to double check for any defaults right before they ship. When someone tells you that they dont double check thier product , it seems to you that they realy dont care if it dose have defaults because they recieved all of their money up front. I am not saying they dont care but that gives you the impression they dont care. I see the doll matrix and you see all of the dolls that people own. Real doll is so popular they leave every other doll manufacture in the dust of how many each doll maufacture has on the Fourm . It seems that they have a manopaly who the whole buisneses that is out there. I can say alot people who who did buy Real Dolls realy has alot of trust and faith in them. I am the type that I have to know them a little before I put my total faith and trust in for someone or some company. Thanks for listining to my problem with Abyss. Hey I see Dottie all of the time. She is certainly a very gorgess doll to look at. If I were ever to get a Real Doll I certainly would want to have her sister when ordering the doll. So thanks for everybodies time

mytime · Post by **mytime** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:26 pm

Someone was saying if Abyss was to double check on thier product, it would take 20 minutes to check things over and they cant afford to do that to everyone. Well I remember Fox News with thier news clip that they said they produce one doll a day. That means at the end of the day who ever puts the dolls in the crate for ship might stay an extra 15 minutes looking it over. If you have 2 people looking it over then its only 7 and half minutes. Or if you have 3 people that would only be 3 and half minutes. They cant aforrd 3 and half minutes from 3 employees giving the doll a double check? Hey guys you are talking about someone dishing out 6500 dollars. Another thing, when you buy a brand new house you are talking about alot more then 6500 dollars. You are talking about one hundred thousand dollars and beyond. When the contractor who makes a aggreement with the seller they negociate for a settlement. The contractor wont lower his price but, he will throw in a couple of goodies with the deal. Sometimes you see them throw in a pool with a real low cost. So back to Abyss , you mean to tell me they cant spare 3 and half minutes from 3 employees to double check on the doll before they put it in the crate. Give me a break. Maybe they are scared that they will see a default and that will delay shipping the doll, and also cost more for the repairs of the doll once it is completed. They say they have someone inspect them, but you know that saying, no one is perfect. A 3 and minute double check certainly would not hurt

IMO this stuff is told in a for Abyss very anoying this way...
All other doll manufacturers work more or less like Abyss does, they want to be paid upfront, they build dolls and check them during and after building process and send them out.
They have lay away plans but it still means that you pay the doll upfront.

Mytime & Helen & Carmen